Z22SE Engine dying now won't start :(

[JonRobinson82]

Hi guys (and gals maybe)

I have a rather strange problem. My car started dying Friday evening (twice in Asda car park, once on the way out, once on the way onto the A13 and once on the way off the A13) before it just wouldn't start anymore and got a tow home from my dad. The next morning it started straight away from freezing cold but then died again within about 5 minutes. It has since being running for less and less time and taking more and more time to start again, to the point where it now won't start at all. It cranks fine although sounds like compression is being lost from a number of cylinders when the spark plugs are in, but a compression test on each cylinder with all spark plugs out shows approx 150 or more psi building up over 2 or 3 strokes. My mechanic friend has said that the loss of compression is most likely more to do with "washing the bore" due to only recently finding the fuel pump relay to stop fuel piling into the cylinders. The fuel pump seems to work fine btw lol and the compression tester I have is just a crappy gauge that screws in to the spark plug aperture so wouldn't trust the reading at all apart from it's reading something lol. I've recently replaced the single spark plugs with Bosch triple jobbies but that was just before it started dying and the car doesn't seem to act any different no matter what plugs are in it. It starts after being left for a while and dies pretty quickly. It still doesn't start now with old or new plugs. I've also replaced the crankshaft sensor (as I was receiving a camshaft position sensor circuit malfunction code on my mates diagnostic) but the eml has now stopped coming on since just before the engine started dying. I've checked all earth connections I could see and the throttle body looks good. In fact everything looks good and like it should run perfect, exactly as it was running between these periods of "sudden death"

Please help I'm reduced to cycling to work and that idea scares me with the weather we're getting now

 

[KevinH]

How many miles has vehicle covered? Is it a Z22SE or Z22YH?

 

[JonRobinson82]

I did choose Z22SE for the reason that as far as I am aware that is what engine I have. and around 81k but the engine was replaced with a new engine at around 33k. Previous owner had engine seize due to some hole on the side of the engine getting blocked? Least that's what I was told.

 

[vocky]

camshaft position sensor circuit malfunction

this can also be caused by a duff coil pack or MAP sensor

 

[JonRobinson82]

Well I tested the coil pack, as far as I connected a wire up to earth/negative and to the spark plug thread while in the little rubber holder thingy, and then also wired a spark plug directly to the metal post on the coil pack and grounded on a bolt on bodywork and head. All tests provided no spark. Unless you have to ground the coil pack itself also I'd say it's pretty definitive. I also took the coil pack apart and one of the pins connecting the coil (I assume) on top to the rest of the pack is a bit burnt and wasn't visible at all until I ripped the connector block apart.

Apologies for the lack of techno babble lol I'm relatively new to the coil pack thing lol

 

[corsaZ22se]

the coil pack picks up an earth through one of 4 the hold down bolts, and can fail with out any warning signs.
if it is a z22se it does not have a camshaft sensor so your mate diag tool may be leading you in the wrong direction?
if there is a burnt connector that need cleaning/replacing.
possibly a new coil pack is needed?

 

[vx-chris]

Crank sensors are known to fail when warm. I had that on my zaffy (although thats a z20ler engine).

It started fine when cold but once it was warm it would fail, so maybe its that?

I will add that i had no fault code showing when mine packed up but has been fine ever since I replaced it.

 

[JonRobinson82]

Never got the chance to get warm. I did replace the crankshaft sensor anyway. It was the coil pack in the end mystery over all fixed

 

[JonRobinson82]

OK so with all the backfiring and misfiring from the coil pack dying a slow and painful death I appear to have gained a rattle on my middle box (exhaust) and have noticed after closer inspection that a blowing under the bonnet wasn't the downpipe/manifold but actually just the mani. More specifically a crack in it. After some research the crack apparently seems to be a common problem.

Question 1:
Is the rattle anything to worry about?

Question 2:
Is the mani crack common?

Question 3:
Should I bother replacing if it's just gonna crack again?

Question 4:
What causes this "common" cracking?

 

[vx-chris]

Time to get a tubular mani me thinks

 

[JonRobinson82]

God that already sounds like £££'s any idea where is good for price? My missus will go divvy if I spend too much but can get past a reasonable amount if it works out cheaper than keep buying standard cast mani every now and then

And my other questions?

 

[vx-chris]

Astra or Vectra or something else?

Question 1........you will probably find it won't be as noticeable when it's warm
Question 2........yes is the simple answer, although i had my Z22SE vectra for about 3 years and it never cracked
Question 3.......I've known people to get them welded up
Question 4.......iirc it's something to do with how they were cast

Cheaper option is to buy a 2nd hand known good one but for performance gains and less chance of it cracking again then go tubular.

Of course all or some of the above could be totally wrong so wait for a 2nd opinion lol

For the Astra g but I believe it's only the decat pipe that won't fit a vectra b as it won't be long enough
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/182195936727
Once again I could be wrong lol

 

[JonRobinson82]

K sweet thanks for the reply.

I got a Vectra B 2.2 CDX (SRi mechanically I believe)

More questions lmao

Question 1:
The coil pack is sorted now although the first replacement had a dodgy connection between the coil and the distributor block. Got a 2nd replacement now which is sweet. Is there any way of making this connection more reliable? Like cut up an old skool electrical terminal block, cut access in the side and use the terminal block to connect the 4 pins on the coil to the 4 pins on the block then seal it all up nicely somehow? I figure if this one fails it's a "better the devil you know" kinda situation. I like the performance I'm getting right now but don't like the idea that at some random point in the future it might just cut to 3 or even 2 cylinders in the middle of a roundabout again when I least expect it.

Question 2:
I have bypassed my egr valve with a DIY gasket with only the hole for the valve, but on a previous quick fix bodge the tab on the head (I assume) that the egr valve bolts to got snapped off :/ shocking schoolboy error I know but had just started a horrible shift pattern and was tired and not thinking apparently. Question is considering I am planning on a ported TB and a tubular exhaust mani can all the pipes for the EGR be removed if I put a cheater in or get egr disabled?

 

[vx-chris]

Question 1......... i wouldnt be cutting holes in any electrical plug and id leave it as it is. Iirc the plug has a little tab anyway so it cant just fall off.

Question 2.......... yes you can remove the egr and the pipe that goes into the air intake manifold but then the hole left in the intake needs plugging up. Of which there are a few ways of doing and a quick search on here.
Thats the only pipe that needs and can be removed.
As for a cheater, just buy a blanking plate with no holes (apart from the two for the bolts lol). Put that on and then put the egr back on but only by one bolt and leave it so its hanging ove the engine.

Hope that makes sense but its been a while since i had a z22se engined car



Edit.....ive just read your post again and have a question for you.
If you have broke where the egr bolts on to, how have you fixed that plate you have put on?

 

[corsaZ22se]

with your exhaust manifold good news is you dont have a mani cat on the vectra B. so a new dbilas one will work fine and if you make a 2.5" down pipe with a 200cpi cat fitted and remove the pre cat you will see so nice gains.
as chris has said easiest way to blank egr is to get a blanking plate but leave the valve connected but hanging over the edge with a longer bolt in one hole.

 

[JonRobinson82]

At the moment the egr is bolted on correctly with the DIY gasket with only the valve hole so egr still operates and I've used plenty of that fire putty stuff and used the broken off tab as best as I can to tighten it down. it's not the best but I think it works.

Further question. If I only remove the pipe that goes into the intake won't that leave a pipe blowing from the exhaust? Why can't that be removed? Where does the exhaust side of the egr get fed from?

 

[JonRobinson82]

Also where should I see this precat cause last time I was under the exhaust/engine trying to find my blowing sound (cracked mani) I don't remember seeing anything substantial apart from the cat under the cabin and this flexi bit of the exhaust?

 

[JonRobinson82]

Sorry second point. I wasn't talking about the connector for the the entire coil pack lol I was talking about the 4 pins that connect the coil/transformer thing to the actual block that distributes the sparks. if you unscrew the 3 screws you can take that heatsink lump off the rest of the coil pack. The problem with my original coil pack and the 1st replacement was an issue with those pins.

 

[KevinH]

Also where should I see this precat cause last time I was under the exhaust/engine trying to find my blowing sound (cracked mani) I don't remember seeing anything substantial apart from the cat under the cabin and this flexi bit of the exhaust?

The pre-cat is located at the top of the down pipe where it bolts to the manifold.
This maybe useful: http://www.z22se.co.uk/resources/pre-cat-removal.42/

 

[figo126]

the pipe should go to the head ? just make a blank to blank it, there was a link on here using a rubber bung to blank the hole into the inlet, the pre cat is in top part of the exhaust , can only see it if you take down pipe off, if z22se engine,, ,maybe different on veccy ?????