My new engine - input needed

Muncher83

I'm on the verge of building a second engine which will at some point be installed in my VX, together with a Harrop supercharger and full 2bular exhaust (if they ever emerge!).

The spec I am looking at is as follows:

Rebored and plateau honed block
Standard Crank
Eagle Rods
Wiseco 8.9 pistons
Ported and flowed LSJ Head including valves and springs
Allecotec Blower Cams
Balance shaft deletion
Lightened flywheel
Uprated clutch
Revised camchain kit
Entire engine balanced

I am looking for internals which are capable of at least 300bhp (which I think that spec should be), with a sensible budget, bearing in mind money could be better spent on some of the bottleknecks (supercharger and exhaust).

What do you guys think to that?

alanoo

I feel it to be the best price / perf ratio you could get but keep in mind the TVS could flow a LOT more than the M62, if you want to reach 350 bhp you'll certainly be able to, easily !

Now the bad point : the stock liners and the stock crank won't last forever with 350 bhp, hi boost and a trackday car, if it will have the same lifespan than the car or not... no one could know.
Another side note too, I'm not 100% certain the Comp Cams blower grind could use the stock springs and stock valve seals, I think I remember they already have some fair amount of valve lift

winstar

I'm with Alanoo on the CR if you go for 8.9:1 your going to need to run far higher boost to make the power and Looking at the TVS map

You can see the heart where you need to be is between 1.5 and 1.7 ER above that your going to need need more cooling as the SC gets less efficient, the one thing the VX really doesn't have much of.

Putting into context a stg 4 VXT runs about 1.7 ER to make ₂₉₀ bhp out at a similar CR, more capacity and revs mean you may get 350 from the same boost level.

As for Cams why not keep the same LSJ cams?

Muncher83

What's ER? Jon at Courtenay seemed to think 9:1 was the kind of compression ratio I should be looking for.

winstar

Muncher83 said:
What's ER? Jon at Courtenay seemed to think 9:1 was the kind of compression ratio I should be looking for.

:oops: I meant PR Pressure Ratio = SC outlet Pressure/SC inlet pressure

ER expansion ratio is across a turbo

I suppose that courtenays must know the engine, just IIRC alot of the US engines use std CR to make the power so the SC doesn't have to work as hard.

alanoo

Folks at cobaltss.net used to raise the CR a bit with the M62 (to 10 or 10.5) but they now almost all re-lower it as it is a bit problematic with the much higher flow of the TVS (I read the TVS flows 30% more per rev than the M62...)

Also, keep in mind the "8.9" figure of the Wiseco's are calculated with a L61/z22se head + HG, I have no idea at all what CR it will lead to with an LSJ head as I cannot find any reliable information about how much cc these are...

vocky

the lsj head doesn't look much different than the z22se head in the combustion chamber, I doubt there is much difference in the cc

exmantaa

As you already want to use the LSJ head, what if you start with a complete 2.0 LSJ or Saab engine?
That should be good for a reliable 300HP with standard components and better suited for some higher revs...
Delete the balancers, mount some stiffer valve springs (The Supertech 78lb seems to be good) and please port the exhaust side. 8)
Do you want to run standard 2,2 Ecu? (Then you may have to change the crank toothed wheel for an 2,2 version as these are differently clocked)
The head of a 2,2 and 2.0 also have different exh. cam lengths!

alanoo

exmantaa said:
(Then you may have to change the crank toothed wheel for an 2,2 version as these are differently clocked)

This one is not possible :wink:

Muncher83

It's what Jon at Courtenay is trying to do with his LSJ engine but he hasn't completed it yet.

It may be a better bet to wait and see what happens with the LSJ engine swap, what happens with the Harrop TVS and what happens with the full 2bular 3 inch before spending any money. At least most of the mapping would then be done already!

exmantaa

alanoo said:

exmantaa said:
(Then you may have to change the crank toothed wheel for an 2,2 version as these are differently clocked)

This one is not possible :wink:

Thought the newer engines had a removable trigger wheel on the crank, but never looked deeply into that.
Everything can be fabricated off course, but as last resort you can always mount an external trigger wheel on the pulley.
Maybe the sensor can be re-clocked for the difference in timing. (Was around 12 degrees if I remember correctly.)

Edit: The LSJ crank has a removable trigger wheel. When this has the same missing tooth spec as a 2,2 trigger wheel, it can be re-clocked. (If the 2,2 is fixed and cannot be swapped..)

(I will just wait on some "cheap" HP-tuners software, as I have an LSJ P12 ECU with complete harness waiting for my LSJ. 😃)

alanoo

Yep, the newest ones have a removable trigger wheel, the only problem is how to replicate the original 7+1 2.2 crank one which is not removable

Not that hard to drill directly in the 2.0 crank I guess...

vocky

standalone would work fine though 🙂

exmantaa

exmantaa said:

Edit: The LSJ crank has a removable trigger wheel. When this has the same missing tooth spec as a 2,2 trigger wheel, it can be re-clocked. (If the 2,2 is fixed and cannot be swapped..)

So 2,2 has a fixed 7+1 trigger wheel...
When you insist on running the 2,2 ecu, your only option will be fabricating some custom hybid trigger wheel for the LSJ crank with the 2,2 specifications. notsure.gif

alanoo

vocky said:
standalone would work fine though 🙂

Not with the 7+1 2.2 OE trigger 😉

(well some works but few, Motec, some Megasquirts versions, next firmware of the Sybele...)

vocky

I was thinking about the additional crank pulley trigger wheel 🙂

rik1083

so are u still going with stage 1 sc first?

Muncher83

Yes.